Ashton Jeanty

[mstrbass2000]

[Reno Hightower]

No surprise that a HOF bound fella can just flat age-out. We saw it before with our very own Big Al. Guys just refuse reality and hope they can ego-vibe the whole team into their fantasy vision.

I don’t mind rebuilding. It’s been long due. By the look of things we finally are. Carroll was the last gasp of doing shit the wrong f[raiders_icon]cking way.

Yes, and that is correct perspective on the current state of the team.

[RunOverByHubbard]

I was surprised when they draft him in the first round given our needs, but then watched his film and he was very impressive in college. But, I am coming around to those at our Forum that (A) think you don't draft a RB that high any more unless they are really, really good; and (B) that he is not as great as I/we/scouts thought he was.

I look at what Jalen Warren is doing for the Steelers. That guy is fast and is a load - and was an UDFA. That's why so many say that you can get a good RB later than the early rounds. Would I trade Jeanty? No, we have a 1st invested in him and it is worth fixing the O-line to see what he can do, that is, look like the runner-up for the Heisman Trophy.

[Cruisin with Tooz]

The issue in drafting a RB that high is related to the surplus value that the team realizes through the rookie pay scale. The rookie pay scale is not position dependent, it is draft slot dependent. So when you draft a low cost position that high instead of drafting a high cost position, you are throwing away cap dollars. EG, you need an OT and a RB. You can get the OT in FA and draft the RB, or you can get the OT in the draft and the RB in FA. Which way is better? The drafted OT and the drafted RB in slot#6 gets $10 million/yr. The FA RB gets $16 million/yr. The FA OT gets $28 million/year. So if you do it the first way it costs $38 million/yr to fill those 2 positions. The second way costs $26 million/yr. Youre throwing away $12 million cap dollars per year x 5 years is $60 million cap dollars over the course of the rookies deal. In terms of lost surplus value, the rookie rb is providing $16 million/yr in on the field value for $10 million cap dollars per year. Thats 6 million in surplus value per year x 5 years is $30 million total surplus value over the 5 years. The rookie OT is providing $28 million in on the field value for 10 million cap dollars per year, or $18 million in surplus value per year. Times 5 years is $90 million in total surplus value over the life of the contract. The difference in surplus value between the two is $60 million. Thats the opportunity cost of drafting Jeanty.

[Attyla]

We used the #6 overall on a 3rd down back

As of right now, we have spent a 6th overall pick on a guy who is not getting it done on the ground. And when you are drafting a RB that high in the draft, the last thing you are looking for is a guy who is catching the ball but not running the ball effectively. I watched Cleveland's 2nd round pick killing it on Sunday thinking to myself man he runs hard and fast. Judkins runs inside and outside and can catch the ball. Hell a 29 year old Tony Pollard did exactly the same in that same game and he was a 4th rounder. And everyone knows with Ward being their QB that all they have to do is key on Pollard and it is game over. And they still could not stop him.

When you are celebrating that your RB catches passes as his value you are striking out. The RB needs to get the tough yards when you need them. Jeanty is not doing that. Now, do not get me wrong, Jeanty has value as a pass catcher, and when it is Mendoza time, that will be added value, but we did not draft a pass catching RB. We drafted a guy who is a tough runner. We are no where near getting what we paid for.

[Hellbound]

You draft someone that high, you expect game changing and elite production. There's rbs in similar situations that went undrafted or drafted later and are producing better results. The excuses for players on the roster need to stop at some point. RB should've never been the pick to begin with, not hindsight, and it's just compounding the retarded decisions this franchise has made

[Willmark]

Did we overdraft Jeanty? Maybe.

The far bigger issue is one that has plagued this franchise for decades. Stop me if you’ve heard this one before: QB

This franchise has never embraced the fact that it’s a QB driven league from the Old Man to the owner who looks like a rutabaga. In the Old Man’s case his experience taught him he could just get a QB of the scrap heap and bam two Super Bowl wins with Plunkett. We know how things have turned out since 1986.

Then Mark. We’ll never know for sure but the franchise’s baffling decision to stick with Boy Wonder for nearly a decade set us back again with next NO draft picks by the Raiders at QB over his entire run. Add to this winning just enough games to keep us drafting in the middle portion of the draft and here we are.

Add in changing coaches every 1.5 years.

How does this tie to Jeanty? Simple. Smart franchises get their QB situation settled first then build around them. We did the opposite. In fact it’s somewhat worse because our Vet QB is playing at a high level.

This compounds season after season and add in bad drafting at other positions (Gruden basically blowing five first round picks) and it should come as no surprise we’re in the situation we are.

Had we done a better drafting since say 2016, Hell even since 2020 we wouldn’t be in situation of needing nearly EVERY pick needing to be perfect.

I continue to believe Jeanty is talented but the line is killing our run game. Sure a better set of WRs would help back up opposing Defenses but again there is that issue of bad drafting rearing its ugly head again.

To close? I don’t think Jeanty the problem per se, he’s a very visible symptom of a much larger issue.

YMMV.

[Rabidraider]

Giving the ball to Jeanty to prove the #6 overall was worth it, and not getting results is just not the way to go.

Give Washington the ball and let Jeanty be the receiving back. If he is injured let him fully heal.

Next year hopefully with an improve Oline revisit him being RB1.

[Attyla]

Giving the ball to Jeanty to prove the #6 overall was worth it, and not getting results is just not the way to go.

Give Washington the ball and let Jeanty be the receiving back. If he is injured let him fully heal.

Next year hopefully with an improve Oline revisit him being RB1.

The most success Jeanty had on Sunday was a "sweep" that got him catching the ball to the outside. It was early in the game if my memory is to be trusted. He had one good run up the gut and that was it on run plays. I think the outside run was an actual run. I would have to look it up and I am being lazy on that. He got stuffed a lot.

That said, I don't know that Washington would fare any better with a bigger workload. I do think the solution lies with the QB. Improve the scope of the position with a guy who can make all the throws improves the RB position because teams have to play back more.

[ALLRAIDERWORLD21]

He's a better receiver right now and leads all NFL running backs in receptions and yargade. Jeanty is a tough matchup in coverage for LBs and Safeties, use him as a slot receiver and let Washington be your 3 down back for now. In fact turn him into a receiver who can also line up in the backfield and run. Might as well get your money's worth.

I think experiencing with Jeanty like this would be a great choice and open up the offense with the him and Washington both on the field at the same time. It's not like you aren't able to still line him at half back whenever you want.

[RunOverByHubbard]

The first game of the years against the Dolphins, he rushed for 4.4 ypc and 102 total yards. Hmmm.. I wonder if the Miami defense was just getting their legs under them (they have a ton of new, young players). Today, Miami is exactly middle of the pack for rushing defense. After that game, he hasn't done squat. I don't think anyone here is against Washington getting more carries. I wonder why the coaching staff disagrees with us? They are getting Jeanty out in space for passes, but that is a different story (compensation for the poor production from the wideouts?).

[ALLRAIDERWORLD21]

As of right now, we have spent a 6th overall pick on a guy who is not getting it done on the ground. And when you are drafting a RB that high in the draft, the last thing you are looking for is a guy who is catching the ball but not running the ball effectively. I watched Cleveland's 2nd round pick killing it on Sunday thinking to myself man he runs hard and fast. Judkins runs inside and outside and can catch the ball. Hell a 29 year old Tony Pollard did exactly the same in that same game and he was a 4th rounder. And everyone knows with Ward being their QB that all they have to do is key on Pollard and it is game over. And they still could not stop him.

When you are celebrating that your RB catches passes as his value you are striking out. The RB needs to get the tough yards when you need them. Jeanty is not doing that. Now, do not get me wrong, Jeanty has value as a pass catcher, and when it is Mendoza time, that will be added value, but we did not draft a pass catching RB. We drafted a guy who is a tough runner. We are no where near getting what we paid for.

Who cares though fior now if you put Jeanty in the slot and he's producing from there while adding another dimension to the offense that defenses have to game plan for. This could help open the run game a bit as Washington as your 3rd down back.

If it helps win games thats the only bottom line I care about. I'm not going to worry about where Jeanty was drafted if he's gets 50 plus receiving yards and a TD a game through the air, plus yards at RB, while contributing to a Raider victory. We can figure that out and point fingers later, but right now it's about getting into the win column by any means possible.

[Attyla]

Who cares though fior now if you put Jeanty in the slot and he's producing from there while adding another dimension to the offense that defenses have to game plan for. This could help open the run game a bit as Washington as your 3rd down back.

If it helps win games thats the only bottom line I care about. I'm not going to worry about where Jeanty was drafted if he's gets 50 plus receiving yards and a TD a game through the air, plus yards at RB, while contributing to a Raider victory. We can figure that out and point fingers later, but right now it's about getting into the win column by any means possible.

Well, two things. One he is not helping Kubiak's offense the way the offense is designed. That is a problem for the team. And two, we aren't winning.

[Rabidraider]

Washington in a small sample averages 4.9.

Why not test that number with more carries?

I think the team is trying to prove the high Jeanty pick was right.

And at this point ,that mindset is wrong.

[RunOverByHubbard]

Washington in a small sample averages 4.9.

Why not test that number with more carries?

I think the team is trying to prove the high Jeanty pick was right.

And at this point ,that mindset is wrong.

I think you are right but it also might be wishful thinking -- he HAS to start breaking some of those runs into long gains, right? I would think that the NFL is not into wishful thinking -- that they have top analytical minds watching film and evaluating all aspects of the club every single day, staring Monday morning after a game. Heck, the assistant coaches probably start watching film Sunday night.

[Rabidraider]

I think you are right but it also might be wishful thinking -- he HAS to start breaking some of those runs into long gains, right? I would think that the NFL is not into wishful thinking -- that they have top analytical minds watching film and evaluating all aspects of the club every single day, staring Monday morning after a game. Heck, the assistant coaches probably start watching film Sunday night.

Yeah, were are just fans and they are the experts. You would think in a rebuilding year they would use it to test out players like Washington, especially when Jeanty's rushing isn't working over most the the first 7 games.