And with the 14th pick the Raiders select…..

[Xramfan]

Discuss…..

[Cruisin with Tooz]

His natural position could be at OG alot of runours out there that JPJ wasn't calling protections when at C & that is a huge no no

If it is true then his natural position is at RG

Also his injury history would kill us more at C than RG as it is easier to replace

Keep him at RG, draft Ioane to play LT, sign Linderbaum at C & let Glaze/Grant battle it out at RT with some actual real coaching helping them

I assume you mean LG for Ioane. While I love him talent-wise at 14, what you are counting on at RT seems very dubious. Given that the FA market has a lot of IOLs to choose from, it might make more sense from a team fit/need perspective to add a guard through FA to compete with Rogers, and draft an OT at 14. From a sabermetric prospective this also makes a lot of sense. When you look at the surplus value of draft picks by position group, on the offensive side of the ball, only the qb position has higher surplus value than the OT position. IOL brings up the rear for surplus value in the offensive position groups.

[chucker]

...at this point, i'm not counting on it, but I would love to see the dude just get through a full season at any position, and give us hope that that (the annual IR thing) isn't just who he is....

I also wondered why he doesn't wear a guardian cap. But I also recently read that guardian caps are likely helpful with respect to CTE - by reducing the number of small shocks that cause CTE - but apparently there isn't evidence of reducing concussions. Ryan Kelly for example just retired due to concussions and his last one was with the use of the guardian cap.

[raider_kin]

I assume you mean LG for Ioane. While I love him talent-wise at 14, what you are counting on at RT seems very dubious. Given that the FA market has a lot of IOLs to choose from, it might make more sense from a team fit/need perspective to add a guard through FA to compete with Rogers, and draft an OT at 14. From a sabermetric prospective this also makes a lot of sense. When you look at the surplus value of draft picks by position group, on the offensive side of the ball, only the qb position has higher surplus value than the OT position. IOL brings up the rear for surplus value in the offensive position groups.

Agree on value of OT but are we sure neither Glaze nor Grant can, with proper coaching and some experience (which Grant did not get last year) start at RT?

[Oaktownonly]

Just trying to go with a plan B if we can't get Linderbaum. We can go JPJ at center but what happens if/when he gets injured?

[raider_kin]

Just trying to go with a plan B if we can't get Linderbaum. We can go JPJ at center but what happens if/when he gets injured?

Draft a center, give him some time to acclimate to the pros, hopefully ready to step in if JPJ goes down?

[Oaktownonly]

Draft a center, give him some time to acclimate to the pros, hopefully ready to step in if JPJ goes down?

I had mentioned Jake Slaughter out of Florida as a possibility.

[WNYRAIDER]

I also wondered why he doesn't wear a guardian cap. But I also recently read that guardian caps are likely helpful with respect to CTE - by reducing the number of small shocks that cause CTE - but apparently there isn't evidence of reducing concussions. Ryan Kelly for example just retired due to concussions and his last one was with the use of the guardian cap.

...yeah, I agree....(why not wear the cap)...but like your comp with Kelly, it does seem like it take increasingly less to result in the next one.....

[Cruisin with Tooz]

...the problem with that is that so many are suggesting a real earlier to mid draft 'sweet spot ', and we have plenty of holes to fill, and not just as starters....

The sweet spot is real. It is at 12. Were right at it. If you are trading up to draft a non-qb player, over the long haul, its a losing proposition. Thats not to say you cant win an individual trade, but on average, you will be giving up more in total combined surplus value of the picks you trade away, than the surplus value you receive with that high pick.

[Cruisin with Tooz]

Agree on value of OT but are we sure neither Glaze nor Grant can, with proper coaching and some experience (which Grant did not get last year) start at RT?

Am I sure? No. But I think its a better bet that Rogers and a FA guard could cover RG, than Glaze and Grant could cover ROT. And the saber aspect is not insignificant either. At pick 14 the projected difference in surplus value of a guard-draftee and a tackle-draftee is roughly 1.75% of the total team salary cap per year. With a salary cap of 300 million thats 5.25 million. If you have 2 players with exactly equal on the field value, and 1 is an OT and 1 is a guard, you are forgoing 5.25 million in surplus value by drafting the guard. To take the guard over the tackle, the guard has to be the much better player.

[Attyla]

The sweet spot is real. It is at 12. Were right at it. If you are trading up to draft a non-qb player, over the long haul, its a losing proposition. Thats not to say you cant win an individual trade, but on average, you will be giving up more in total combined surplus value of the picks you trade away, than the surplus value you receive with that high pick.

It depends on what your draft pick numbers are. I have seen teams with 10 plus picks. You are never going to keep 10 rookies on a roster, even considering the practice squad, so trading up a bit using the picks you know you can afford to lose is a winning proposition. You climb up 4 or so slots to get a guy you know is worth that pick and you benefit the team and you don't hurt your draft at the same time. Even for a pick that is not a QB. And the sweet spot of a draft is depending upon the individual draft. This draft, the spot is around 16 or so. You get above that, you are getting a good contributor. You get below that, you are rolling the dice. Other drafts, you see the spot fall to 20 or so. The year we drafted Hayden, it was right at 5.

[mstrbass2000]

I think we can get a really good option at guard at pick 14 who can start day one.

we can still get a good guard in teh 3rd rd or 4th rd

[vtraider]

It depends on what your draft pick numbers are. I have seen teams with 10 plus picks. You are never going to keep 10 rookies on a roster, even considering the practice squad, so trading up a bit using the picks you know you can afford to lose is a winning proposition. You climb up 4 or so slots to get a guy you know is worth that pick and you benefit the team and you don't hurt your draft at the same time. Even for a pick that is not a QB. And the sweet spot of a draft is depending upon the individual draft. This draft, the spot is around 16 or so. You get above that, you are getting a good contributor. You get below that, you are rolling the dice. Other drafts, you see the spot fall to 20 or so. The year we drafted Hayden, it was right at 5.

Maybe most teams don't keep 10 rookies. But has there been a team with that many picks that had as many holes as the raiders

[Attyla]

we can still get a good guard in teh 3rd rd or 4th rd

We can get developmental guys in the 3rd and 4th or we can get a starter caliber NT in the third. I said really good, not good. We need a really good guard so that is an Ioane or Proctor level guy. That quality is not there in the third or fourth round

[Attyla]

Maybe most teams don't keep 10 rookies. But has there been a team with that many picks that had as many holes as the raiders

That depends on free agency.

[Spurs Raider]

I’d fully expect us to look at Sam Hecht should Linderbaum not materialise and even Coogan late on.